“We want to be the Google Maps for the indoors”: The Monitor meets Tamzin Lent
TW // sexual violence
The Monitor is excited to kick off its Tech After Dark series with Editor-in-Chief Maya Dharampal-Hornby talking to Tamzin Lent, founder and CEO of Where You At (WYA). WYA is an app that is tackling sexual violence and harrasment by enabling users to share their precise locations with friends in nighttime venues.
Maya
Before we get into the nitty gritty of WYA, I want to start by saying a massive congratulations for being chosen for Forbes 30 Under 30 in the Social Impact category. It is an amazing achievement and must feel so rewarding to have your work recognised in such a way. How does the idea of social impact resonate with WYA’s mission?
Tamzin
It is one of our core values. I believe in being able to make meaningful, impactful change and being able to deliver it in the best way we can. WYA is trying to build a safer world for everyone.
Maya
Could you tell me about what inspired you to found WYA?
Tamzin
I had a number of bad experiences of losing friends at busy events and ending up in quite vulnerable and unfortunate situations.
[...]
I was really fuelled by one experience where I got separated from my friends and my drink was spiked – horrible things happened to me.
I hope WYA is a tool which will enable people to locate each other, [and so] feel safer and more empowered to enjoy their nights out. I’m really building towards that vision where whatever happened to me isn’t such a normal and ubiquitous experience because I know that experiences like my one that drove me to create the app are really common. And they shouldn’t be.
Maya
And to that end, could you describe to me how the app works?
Tamzin
So at the moment we have a long-term vision of it as a friend in your pocket that you’re always going to have [...] At the moment you log in, you’re able to see a venue floor plan and locate your friend inside that floorplan. So you can see if your friend is by the bar, or by the dance floor. It works on multiple floors, and we’re working on optimising the UI/UX to be as useful as possible.
And if you want to alert your friends, you can send a ping to people inside the vicinity of the venue.
Maya
And how exactly does the technology work?
Tamzin
So the technology, when I first envisioned it, was a pretty simple concept. Essentially we would go into venues and put in these little bluetooth beacons which create this bluetooth infrastructure inside the spaces which permit really high precision indoor positioning and indoor mapping. Users would be able to share their location with their friends by adding each other. We got our patent granted for that technology enabling offline friend finding and indoor mapping.
So that’s the core of it–it’s definitely evolving and has evolved. There’s new elements we’re exploring hardware elements, but at the core it’s this mesh system between phones and bluetooth devices installed inside the venues.
Our approach is collaborative with venues. The venues provide us with their map for the space which we upload onto our system, and do some branding to make it more user friendly, and then we install these little devices that you put around the venue. Once the system’s in, it creates this offline infrastructure.
Maya
How on earth do you do that at a festival?
Tamzin
We can actually use GPS in festivals, but we also put the bluetooth devices in pillar posts, or any infrastructure or surface that’s available.
Honestly, I’ve spent so much of the last year on ladders.
Maya
You’re a hands-on founder! Could you tell me about how exactly data insights from WYA are being used?
Tamzin
This is very much still in development but the long-term vision is providing a really smooth experience for operators to be able to understand where there’s pinch points or pain points inside a venue, and iterate quite rapidly. So, for example, if there’s a large number of specific incidents flagged [we will let a venue know]. In the future, I am hoping to build a responsive tool where users can contact operators directly on the app, and operators can come and deal with their situation.
Maya
Have you found that, for instance, if you have three people reporting instances from a dark corridor, venues have been receptive to installing a light or security?
Tamzin
Most of the venues are extremely committed to make as many changes as possible to support their customers, and make it a better experience. So, on the whole, they’ve been very open-minded and excited to partner to learn as much as they can about how to provide a better customer experience.
It’s been really exciting in that respect. From my personal experience of having had a bad incident at a club, I didn’t personally get that vibe, so it’s been amazing to see that clubs do actually care a lot about customer safety.
Their and our number one priority is safety, and optimising the space to make it as safe as possible. I'd like to take our insights to really empower the venues to make smarter and better decisions to increase feelings of safety.
When you’re 18, you can’t just let loose–a club isn’t a utopian, safe space. So yeah, I’ve been really delighted by how much venues really back and believe in this safe vision.
Maya
At the moment WYA has launched in nightclubs and increasingly festivals. In the next five years, what other spaces are you looking to expand into?
Tamzin
Everywhere! I just find it personally a really frustrating problem–I just went to the Hackney Half Marathon to see my amazing housemate complete the half but I couldn’t find anyone anywhere because there was no service. The long-term goal is every single event–whether it’s a large conference, or a large stadium, or a marathon. I want people to be able to locate their friends, and have that manufactured serendipity, rather than the risk of “hopefully I’ll bump into these people I know there” […] We want to be the Google Maps for the indoors.
Maya
Could you tell me about WYA’s pivot away from solely women’s safety into this model addressing more ubiquitious problems?
Tamzin
For me, at the core WYA will always be about women’s safety. That is my mission. I don’t want my 16-year old cousin to have the same experience that I had of losing my friends and being in a vulnerable situation and not having the ability to find support. But I think it’s expanded due to me ultimately recognising that this is such a human problem–you know losing other people, struggling to find things and people.
I want to get WYA to a point where it’s so ubiquitous and universal where the problem doesn’t exist any more – or at least where there’s a kind of potential solution. But to get to the point where it can be that standard, it needs a more expansive appeal. It needs to solve a human problem rather than just a woman’s problem. So yeah, I think it’s kind of evolved naturally and we’re currently in the process of scaling it.
I just find the problem fucking frustrating to be really honest – I’ll keep working on it until I know that most clubs or festivals or conferences that I go to, I will be able to find people.
I’m five foot so maybe that’s the driving force.
Maya
WYA was founded in the same year as Everyone’s Invited. Did Everyone’s Invited, and the conversation it opened up, have any impact on your vision?
Tamzin
Definitely. I mean Soma Sara is so inspiring, and I think Everyone’s Invited has been such an important moment for people in the UK, in terms of waking up and realising how extensive and pervasive this issue is, and how rape culture in general filters down so much.
I think it’s so important to seeing female founders creating real change and bringing such an extensive impact. I was so inspired by seeing how much Soma achieved with Everyone’s Invited in terms of enacting real change educationally, and bringing the problem to the nation’s attention.
For me, it was in the middle of Covid and it felt like there was an opportunity for society to have a bit of a reset or rethink about how we treat each other. I think that Everyone’s Invited was so cool in basically helping people to realise that this rape culture that has been so normalised is really, really wrong, and it’s not something that anyone wants the next generation to grow up facing some of the things that we did.
I’m very thankful to be able to witness such a thing hopefully change in my lifetime.
Maya
I would love to see WYA and Everyone’s Invited collaborate. You’ve already partnered with the Night Times Industry Associations and even made a beer with Mad Squirrels, do you have any more partnerships in the work, or dream collaborations?
Tamzin
Yeah, we’ve got a lot of dream collabs. What we’re really looking to do at the moment is find sponsors and brands that really get our values and beliefs and basically help us roll out the technology to as many places as possible.
So an example of what we did previously was with the drinks brand Malibu who sponsored the technology installation at a number of venues. And I think that, for most of us, that really benefits everyone. You know, these brands taking social responsibility, and supporting nightlife and grassroots organisations.
We’re looking at doing something similar with councils. Taking a top-down approach where 20-30 venues could have the installation sponsored. So, essentially dream collabs at the moment are looking for organisations that are keen to help get this technology into as many venues as possible.
In the long term, I’m also looking for organisations to work with when it comes to surveys and getting the educational piece out, because I think we’ve got a really great opportunity with the app in the hands of thousands of users.
Maya
Speaking of education, do you have any advice for people balancing studies at university and entreprenurship?
Tamzin
I think it’s a really important question. From my experience, I think the opportunity to do both is a strength. Having access to a really great, rich university ecosystem enables you to access some fantastic potential team members as well as potential investment opportunities. So my advice, I guess, would be to really lean into it and see it as a strength.
I was very supported by incubator programs, accelerator programs–we actually got invested in by Cambridge Enteprise and then by Cambridge Angels. I would say just to use these–they are really rare and brilliant opportunities. A lot of universities – whether its Imperial, UCL, or Oxford or Cambridge, or Nottingham - are extremely supportive of entrepreneurship.
Once you leave, it can be very difficult to access those services, those same networks, or meet those same interesting people across multiple disciplines. So I would really just lean into it and get the most you can from it.
Maya
When you received investment from the likes of Cambridge Enterprise and Cambridge Angels, what did that funding enable you to do?
Tamzin
Very much build out our technology and really bring the product to life. Especially from the early stage [when we just had a] prototype, an idea–it helped us to validate it, and start getting that product market face.
Also what I would like to say is that, specifically Cambridge Entreprise and Cambridge Angels opened up these great networks of founders, entrepreneurs, and investors that can really give you great and expert advice and opinions on how to move your product along, and get it to the next stage. Those networks are really, really phenomenal.
I’ve been also really fortunate to find some investors and mentors in one. So, through Cambridge Enterprise and Cambridge Angels, I met James Thomas, who has been a really hands-on and supportive investor – who I met doing a pitch at Cambridge Enterprise. It’s really enabled so much growth and movement. I would just highly recommend tapping into these ecosystems.
I’d also say that, if I could go back in a time, I would make more effort to meet as many other, like-minded entrepreneurial people as possible [...] It’s such an amazing opportunity to be in the same place as really creative types and marketing types and [then] com-scis and engineers. Having that array of people in one place at one time is so rare, so I’d really recommend going out and meeting as many people as possible because you never know if your next-door neighbor, or the person that sits next to you at the library is a potential co-founder.
I recently had the privilege of being part of a panel at Queen’s College, Cambridge. I was invited by Ramsey Fargher who’s a fantastic founder and CEO and CTO [...] It was super inspiring to see all these first, second, and third year postgraduate students in one place, sharing their different visions for the different companies that they were building, and I think it’s just very rare, you know, in life to get that combination of people that are so young, hungry, energetic, and genuinely very mission-driven – they want to change the world and have a real tangible impact.
Maya
And on the flipside, what you say to those who have an idea for a start-up, but don’t want to pursue higher education?
Tamzin
I would just say 100% go for it. I think we always regret what we don't do or what we don't, the things we don't pursue and the things we don't take. I’ve met so many inspiring founders and entrepreneurs that didn’t pursue higher education and went straight for it – and have since made a lot of money!
Don’t let the pressure of “I have to go to uni, I have to get a degree, I have to do that” get in the way of your dream [...] I think another piece of advice I say is that there’s never going to be a right time for anything. If you are only going to pursue an idea at the right time and right place, there’s never going to be that perfect moment – you should instead just go for it. To be honest, when I started I really wanted the right, perfect moment: I wanted the perfect founding team and environment to build it. I applied for quite a few incubators and accelerators, as I looked for the right people to join my team at the earliest stages. And I think if I had let that pressure of “I need the perfect time” hold me back, I wouldn’t have got to where I am now.
I’m not saying don’t do any planning – You definitely need a clear plan! But I think if you really believe in something and you’re the person to deliver or recreate this, you should listen and lean into it. A hundred percent.
Maya
For more advice, how can people reach you?
Tamzin
Please contact me at tamzin@whereyouat.co.uk. I’d be absolutely thrilled to support anyone and answer any questions.
At my college, two years above me, I had Grace Beverley for example. I had quite a few role models and people I’d seen make a real difference and create incredible businesses [...] I would love to help anyone and to answer any questions. [...] I’ve had so many people pay it forward to me, and support me and answer my annoying questions or any key concerns I’ve had, and I’d just love to do the same for anyone.
Maya
You mention Grace Beverley who has recently spoken out about the inequities in the funding landscape between young male and female entrepreneurs. How would you say your experience has been as a young female entrepreneur navigating the tech scene in the UK, and finding investors? Do you think there are any noticeable differences from the experiences of your male counterparts?
Tamzin
Really good question. Obviously there’s the stat that only 2% of VC funding goes to female founders – that’s obviously staggering and disappointing.
I have been incredibly privileged – I’ve mainly been supported, as I’ve mentioned, by Cambridge Enterprise and Cambridge Angels, and a lot of funding from some great family offices and angel investors who have taken a bat on me and believed in my vision. In particular, Tony Mallin from Star Capital has been my main angel investor and support. I’m incredibly grateful to him. I’ve also had some incredible investors like Carolyn Dawson, the CEO of Founder’s Forum.
I’m very privileged and grateful that I’ve managed to get the funding that I have. Yet, in terms of my experience as a young entrepreneurs I personally feel like the traditional VC funding route hasn’t been particularly open to me [...] the 2% number speaks for itself.
There definitely should be a lot more that’s put into women-owned businesses. I think sometime it is seen like virtue-signalling–like “oh how many female founders are in someone’s portfolio”. But it’s important it is backed up by practical investment, like how Grace Beverley invests in women-owned businesses. My dream in life would be to set up a VC fund and be able to invest in woman-owned businesses.
Maya
Could you outline more of the challenges that contribute to that startling 2% figure?
Tamzin
I do have a bit of a rant in me about this. I once had email feedback from an investor, who said ‘I don’t want to be sexist but investors are worried that women will take feedback [from a pitch] more emotionally, and won’t be super responsive to feedback when they’ve had a bad pitch–like they’ll start crying’.
I think there’s a bit of a lack of transparency around feedback to women in the same way there’s feedback to men. I think that really harms. I don’t think it’s the sole reason for why things are the way they are, but until this man was quite transparent with me about it, I hadn’t realised how there’s a lot of times where I pitched and then got completely ghosted, and I never got feedback. I wonder whether they were worried I was going to talk shit about them online, or burst into tears. It made me realise there’s a real absence of feedback to women in general.
I think that would be my ask. There should be a lot more transparency and clarity around when women do pitches [...] it would be way more useful to have feedback saying ‘that pitch was really bad’, or ‘you didn’t deliever as much as we expected’ or ‘you missed out on these clear aspects’.
Maya
Have others shared similar experiences with you?
Tamzin
I’ve had conversations with people who work in VC about this, but I haven’t discussed it too much [with founders]. It does feel like this unwritten certainty that if a guy walks in [to a pitch] really ballsy and, you know, puts his hoodie over his head and pitches the new Tik Tok, they’ll invest in him, while my super-slick prepared presentation will not be. I think, on the one hand, there’s a general misogyny or general bonding or -
Maya
Implicit bias?
Tamzin
Yes, exactly. That’s the word. But there’s also an element of ‘OK maybe my pitch wasn’t great and people are scared of telling me or giving me real feedback’. It was really interesting for me to realise that I could have learned a lot more if [they’ld] have just been honest with me about my pitch not being great, rather than like saying ‘oh it was great’ and then silence.
Maya
Yes, and then to return to the phrase you used before - ‘unwritten certainty’ - the fact you aren’t being given feedback means that we don’t have data to be able to extrapolate patterns from about why investors don’t want to invest in female founders. No doubt the feedback sheets, if written, would end up looking very similar to one another.
Tamzin
This is really interesting, yes. My friend, Ahana, co-founded Clear, a skincare community app. We were talking about this the other day, the way that VCs and investors, in general, speak to female founders is really different [from male counterparts]. [...] It’s much more about reducing risk rather than the size of the opportunity. It’s a well-known thing. How they speak to a male founder is like ‘how are you going to go for this opportunity, or what are the ways you can penetrate this market’. It is very focused on the opportunity. Whereas for women, it tends to be a lot more focused around ‘what are the risks? What are the challenges? How are you going to capture this market?’
Maya
We have spoken a lot about gender, but how would you say the inequities are felt intersectionally?
Tamzin
I can’t remember the exact stat but approx 0.25% of VC funding goes to Black female founders** – it’s alarmingly low. To leave it on a hopeful note, I think that it’s changing and there is a lot more focus on diverse founders and diverse portfolios [...] it’s just something that I think [funders] need to hurry up with because it’s one of those rare spaces in life where you can have a real tangible impact in a really short amount of time. If a company is [invested in] and grows, in 10-15 years that company’s founder could then support other founders, and it would become a waterfall effect. I just think it’s important that people get on with it.
Maya
Agreed. And to round off our first Tech After Dark feature, Tamzin, what’s your favourite night in London?
Tamzin
Anything at The Colour Factory – it’s a partner so I’m biased but I always have a good night. That, or Drumsheds.
** Between 2009 and 2019, Black founders received just 0.24% of venture funding - Black female founders received just 0.02%.
